Working in biglaw reddit
Working in biglaw reddit. Plus, you can work anywhere. There are not a lot of in-house litigation jobs, but there are plenty of in-house transactional jobs. 7. You’re expendable. If you want a more flexible lifestyle just go to a firm where that’s the culture. Worse yet, when people ask "do you just love being a lawyer" I try to fake it but after 10 minutes I usually breakdown and say I hate everything. International lawyers in big law. Hours are a typical 9-5, sometimes meetings earlier or later to accommodate different time zones, but I do only like 10-20 hours of ACTUAL work a week on average. In my view Big4 does not have “tax lawyers”, at least not equivalent to what the role is at a traditional law firm/BigLaw, even if you are in PWC Legal/ EY Law etc—they are just tax consultants moonlighting under a different letterhead. I know money doesn’t buy happiness but I couldn’t make a dent in my student loans on a small salary and I know leaving biglaw so soon could have a potential on my career later on. Not in biglaw, but I think another point to consider whether it's worth it or not is what type of practice area you want to go in. are okay too. In terms of salary, at least in my sector (tech in London) the salaries for experienced counsels are between £80k—£150k. It's alternating weeks of 30 and 60. find the work you like the most. 5 years post-law-school experience now, and my base comp is ~$250K, 10% 401K matching, and 25% bonus target. Before I became a biglaw lawyer i worked for a few years as a medical doctor (internal medicine). In-house: advice needed! Hi all - I’m deciding between a lateral move to a V10 biglaw firm as a 5th year and an in house position at a very large but niche-industry company (in a field I like and that had a positive outlook). Of course, all of the above is somewhat generalized and there will likely be nuances depending on the firm and practice group. Yes. It depends on how broad you define biglaw. Slightly slow year, usually bill closer to 2000. I figured i'd last a few years. There are roughly 100,000 people working at amlaw 200 firms. It appears to be the case that hours for junior associates in big law are terrible, involving 60-80+ hours / week, with common work on weekends and vacations, according to most Redditors. For a first year, 1%. Some V10 firms absolutely WORK you. Very transferrable skills too, as private fund raising is practically the same all across the big jurisdictions of the world. 27000 of them are in New York, 15000 in DC and 9500 in Los Angeles - so those 3 cities account for half of all biglaw jobs. I would say that in addition to the prestige (and negative perceptions of PI work) people go into biglaw because it's a low-risk high salary, whereas PI has a higher risk and a higher likelihood of making little money, but a smaller chance of making more money than most people ever do in biglaw. When you’re done you’ll be replaced. Don’t think this is all that off base but I think there are more like 500-1000 SAs. They were probably making $160,000 in regional biglaw and got bumped to $170,000-$180,000 at a senior manager. Consider doing the SQE in the UK when you make the move to get the Solicitor of E&W there. Reply. Very few associates make it 5 years in biglaw - you shouldn't design your life as if you'll be making that salary forever. In BigLaw I was generally able to work 40-50 hours/week, with occasional 2-3 week stretches of 12-hour days. In house can be a much more standard corporate job where you’re expected to work 9-5. They also are full professional attire, whereas in NY you can easily do business casual (I NEVER wear a blazer and wear more work pants and cotton turtlenecks as opposed to full suits). I believed in social justice, democratic socialism (to some extent), and secular The hours are basically the same, but of course firms/groups/partners differ and every practice has its ups and downs in terms of hours. I've worked at a couple of DC biglaw shops, and the emphasis on facetime is definitely lower, and the dress a little more casual. Don't mind working long hours, but looking at which firm would give me the most hands-on experience earlier in my career -- where would I be able to second-chair a deposition or go to court as a junior associate instead of doing only doc review till my fifth year? My two cents is that if you are worried about being a present father, don't try to make the move to BigLaw. Working hours are equally crazy depending on the practice and the pay is much lower in Paris. But the offer I got from them was $100k less than my BigLaw offer. I currently work 8-730 Mon-Fri (sometimes later) and generally I’m at an amlaw 100 firm (biglaw with mid market clients) and most people still work from home most of the time. The ones with experience were able to recognize that their unhappiness wasn't simply a factor of working in a white collar job, but rather of the lifestyle specifically. It’s going to vary from practice group to practice group. Firms play lip service to work-life balance, and accept that hacks will eventually stop working and you’ll have to find new ones and that’s okay! Finally…be gentle with yourself - biglaw is full of hustle culture loving folks. Edit - many Biglaw firms have a partner who has done, or is doing, some wrongful convictions or death penalty work. Answers related to tax law are especially welcome. Fortunately, a BigLaw pedigree tends to open other doors -- especially on the transactions side. I have worked in warehouses working 10 hours a day 6 days straight doing back-breaking manual labor. That is the main difference between NYC and most other cities (although this dynamic may be changing in the new post-covid world). You end up working full time hours for less than full time pay. I work in our Houston office and we have sent 2 attorneys to Singapore in the last 3 months. Slow week: 30 billables, 40-45 total; average/normal week: 40-50 billables, 55-60 total; busy week: 55-65 billables, 70 total; closing week: 70+ billables and basically all time is billable. 15 minutes because I walk. That’s an extra 3 hours and 20 min a week. It seems difficult. I cannot even converse with people outside of biglaw for more than 5 minutes without running out of things to say. Corporate is probably impossible, given the number of last minute, all night fire drills my transactional counterparts in NY seem to face. I work for a magic circle firm in the US. Three years ago biglaw firms weren't imagining we would all have spent the last year working remotely in a pandemic. In some ways biglaw makes you a better lawyer, in other ways small firms make you a better lawyer. The experience honestly depends a lot on the firm, which office of that firm you’ll be working in, and which type of law you’ll be practicing. I am an investment funds associate btw. Learning how to delegate tasks and construct a whole from multiple sources is critical. If it’s getting into If, and only if, they actually get decent grades should they even begin focusing on BigLaw. The balance depends on the firm, too. As an associate you have a lot less free time. Very few mistakes can’t be fixed in biglaw. So, great work-life balance, lots of waiting around doing nothing. Some firms have their tax group as a support group to the larger corporate groups. Cap markets tax work will be more chill than M&A tax. There’s 100k difference in total comp and it’s ultimately a question of known evil I have adhd and honestly I struggled with billing. Given the two options, I'd choose biglaw every ikk888. Unless you have a babysitter/nanny who is on call 24/7 and available on literally a moment's notice, nope. Lit would probably be difficult, but doable. Oct 8, 2022 · The definition of Biglaw. Your work is also often different from what you do in law school. ADMIN MOD. but again, the Reply reply. Maybe another group, at your current firm or another firm, would vibe better. biglaw_associate. Many NYC midlaw firms probably work harder than Minneapolis biglaw. For some, it's a prestige thing, being able to work with the biggest companies in the world on major, and often highly complex, matters. NYC has the most biglaw jobs by far, and pretty much every practice group in a firm will have a strong representation in their NY office. Some partners are rude, honestly. I've also read that minimum billable hours for big law tend to be around 1900 or so, with 2000+ being usual / recommended as well. Even with interest, you can pay that off in 3 years or less. 2. 5% went to a national firm in any market, which includes national firms in NC offices and other flyover markets. My work product/writing was good based on my yearly review but it takes me like 12-14 hours just to bill 8. If you go to a regional school, such as UHouston, it won't be true that NYC biglaw is the easiest to get. There’s probably more corporate practice in SF than DC, since the latter is so litigation and regulatory focused. That’s 4 gym visits. Not to be a downer but I’m looking to leave big law and go somewhere without billables. I felt like I could take two hours in the middle of the day for a peds appointment and no one cared if I was still billing enough. So I just work insane hours just to get to 1700-1800. I personally cannot tolerate diligence or deal work at all. The more likely scenario is they came in from "biglaw" in a regional market that is not NY market and gives small discretionary pay increases. In House: literally this just means working for a company so the range is massive. Check the In-House compensation surveys from Major Lindsey Africa and Robert Half, but in my experience they can be a bit high for whatever reason. The best example for this would be jobs in the field of investment banking and high finance or even some lower-tier tech sectors. tl;dr: It is not worth it to start as an associate in a BigLaw firm. How many hours do NYC Big Law attorneys work? Asking about both billables and actual hours worked. I also bill 45-55/hrs wk in biglaw, which is very possible and maybe even typical in tax. It'll much, much, much easier for a UHouston grad to get a BL job in Houston than in NYC. At least not yet. That said, I think the in-house world is just so variable. If you want to work on huge public deals, Wachtell and Davis Polk get you that. So far my workload hasn’t been too bad and i want to take on additional responsibility, specifically, practicing medicine again (as a medical doctor). You will likely do at least one over the summer. I’m not in biglaw myself but I know biglaw attorneys. You get that at large firms working large cases/deals. Biglaw junior/midlevel associates often complain about mindnumbingly boring work like doc review and due diligence - tax associates do far less of this type of work and instead do more research, drafting, and issue-spotting early on. •. There are also anomalies in certain markets. Edit: It looks like only 6. Most of my time in biglaw it was alright, nothing amazing. That seems about right from my experience. If you have a 30 minute commute; guess what—you’re burning 50-100% of your “free time”. From a father's point of view, the pre-school years are some of the most important to be present because they aren't in school yet and they are constantly changing. Does anyone have any advice, considering the current market? 0. (1) Make sure that you remember how to write a solid research memo. Bad day I work till midnight or later. Typically, you have the same downsides but a far worse pay. In my humble experience, the corporate associates wait around until t4-5pm when the board of a company has made a decision. Then they start working. Associates are incentivized to bill as many hours as possible while working as little as possible. Otherwise, it’s all menial and terrible. Securitization is especially chill usually: Sidley, Paul Hastings, Proskauer, Milbank, Cadwalader, Orrick, Dechert, Hunton all do a lot of that. Another was meant to go to London this year, but due to COVID that got pulled down. It is expected and normal. The pay is published. (2) Pretty different. inter-office work relationships (i. After a long enough stint, you'll be very good at making your work product look and feel flawless. The weeks of 30 are not vacation, you log in or commute and have wasted time between stuff, trainings, pointless staff meetings, stuff. Also, it makes your resume more attractive for when you finally look for a nice in house job 😂. Law firms, and BigLaw firms in particular, are very stressful environments for most people. I have worked on 3 continents as a tax lawyer. But I take an hour to myself throughout the day. What you want does exist in smaller markets fwiw from personal experience. e. 17. 150k USD is quite high pay compare to Chinese lawyers' (most of the biggest law firms pay their entry level lawyers no more than 50k USD a year) You can live peacefully in Shanghai with 150k USD (if you don't want to buy a house) Reply reply. In BigLaw, you might have 1-2 hours to yourself some days. To put it in perspective: earlier this year, I took my wife, her sister, and our niece to see Taylor Swift. Hey everyone! I’m an LLM student graduating from a T14 and looking to get into BigLaw, in particular M&A (either public or PE). Biglaw is way more hours than big4. In another state. Add in the 10-20 per firm for the Mayers and Winstons of the world and another 5-10 for the myriad of smaller offices and you get to a bit under 1000 quickly. I wish you guys good luck. My comp is okay, IMO. It depends on the group - I work exclusively with people in Central and Mountain time, no one in DC, so it doesn’t matter in terms of face time whether i’m there or not, and no one is keeping tabs on me. Hi! I spent a few years in Big Law! I’d say typical day I’d wake up at 5am, workout, head to the office by 7am, spend the first hour responding to emails that came in overnight and then I would try to schedule any client calls for the day. Before I started law school, I was an optimistic, motivated, and generally healthy individual. ago. In England, security has to be registered with Companies’ House to be publicly available within 21 days of it being created. If you have a question in law, you figure it out. Now, I'm not calling OP a liar. Think about 40 mins per day—add it up. NYC firms may be 80 while Atlanta firms may be 50 hours, for example. I want happiness like she has but I know that would mean giving up biglaw. Base is $176k, 20% target bonus, annual grants of $130k ish RSUs with 3 year vesting. And biglaw hours don’t compare to big4. Build an emergency fund. BigLaw is not for everyone. Biglaw is the term that the legal industry uses to describe the most successful and largest law firms, and the attorneys that work there are typically called Biglaw attorneys. 3% went to NYC in 2022. I'm a 5th year in biglaw. There seems like more variance in house. Most biglaw firms have their payscale the same across all of their US offices. If international assignments are what you want, you can find a firm to support that. You have to go through a million channels to get one thing done or to get the proper authority or essential items needed. I think there’s one thing about working hard, lots of people work hard for a lot less. The average ADHDer is great at hustling…when hyperfocusing…but not so great at it when the job is boring af. The mid-sized firm had better work-life balance than my current firm. One-stop-shop with 200+ lawyers on site - learning how to work in groups is key. Not sure about 2 years, but I remember hearing a stat a few years ago that about 75% leave BL by the 5th year. Seem to have pretty good job security though (if they are good). Don’t try to fight it too much. As OP mentioned, there is the tech focus in SF, of course. You can be at a bad firm or a good firm, but I think in general most biglaw experiences won’t differ TOO much from one another. I had a clear vision of my future and a healthy relationship. Partners in BigLaw are incentivized to get clients, work as little as possible, and make associates work as much as possible. Usually don't work weekends. If you want to live a little bigger, you can still easily keep it at $5k a month and have $8k left over. Associates in London work very very hard and are paid less. Career-wise, it's a good place. The issue is the monotony and billing time mechanism. PRO: more money due to the fact of the firms ability to pay higher salaries. Biglaw really teaches you to be detail oriented and organizational. I'll be back in the office tomorrow (sat) and Sunday. big tech is likely to be high $100s/low $200s with a lot of stock. I just got put on matters that I'm actually passionate about and now I'm thinking I can make it to partner. descartes127. Financing, Banking, Dispute Resolution - US law firms usually hire US-qualified lawyers in London and Paris. I value a short commute in biglaw. Secondly, opportunities for in-house and government work hardly exist for recent graduates. You can get biglaw outside T14, you just need to be at LEAST top 25% and law review or something - the rank required increases as the school’s rank decreases. I work in Iowa, where there are a few firms that start at 140-150k—a killing for Des Moines—with much better hours and partnership prospects than you’ll find in Chicago biglaw. It goes a long way. Some of these large law firms have more than one thousand partners and span across the United States and globe. Yeah it's worth it. know people at well funded startups making mid $100s, people at startups betting on unicorn status making equity and $75k. That being said, for the months of July and August, I've had 6 days off total. And one night you get hit with 5 hours of work at 8pm. 5-2x as many hours for 3+x the money. In-house it has typically been 10-12 hours on weekdays and a half day Saturday or Sunday as standard with occasional bigger pushes. I don't think some people in this industry know what terrible jobs look like. A few thoughts from a former Big Law associate who, after landing in the hospital with heart issues, left to create multiple 7-figure firms and find deep meaning in the practice: Big Law is a system. A few of my colleagues have young kids and they often say that was the reason why they moved in-house. , working with attorneys in different offices on projects/cases - i don't know if this really applies to litigation though). Just do your best to make connections and network within your firm - work cross office if available and keep the positive/excited outlook that you have. • 2 yr. Just make sure you are testing the waters during OCI and the internship. wilsontennisball. Lots of people like nyc, but many just see it as a fantasy and don’t realize you’re paying 5k+ to live in a box with rats outside your door. My second suggestion is to “quit in place. Keep your fixed monthly expenses low. 10. The General Rule for any Career: The higher the pay, the greater the demand for long working hours. Normal day I work from 10am to 7 or 8pm. I’m at about 10. what the office was like when the interviewer started there, how has it changed and what they think the near-future holds for that office that's what i can think of. It plugs people in and takes people out. Mornings I usually would have check ins or meetings with partners on matters and then off to the races I work in a secondary market, 190k is then first year salary, major city as well, costs 2500 to live in luxury and have a 15 minute commute. 13 votes, 13 comments. The networking way of trying to meet the people at a law firm and maybe get an interview, is just leading me to dead ends. BigLaw maternity leave is so, so generous. For a junior partner maybe 60%. They are also very smart. After working for several years in biglaw I have no hobbies, friends, or interests. I'm gonna bill 1800 this year. It’s making you miserable because it’s miserable. 5 hours of billed time. In the long run it probably is better on a pay/per-hour basis anyway. ”. Usually, the work is much more difficult in the law firm. Anywhere on the west side that’s not Marina because it’s ass getting in and out of there during traffic. Nepotism, luck, happening into a law firm interview and showing off your photographic memory. BIG clients - having large corps as clients entails complicated and nuanced work. Since my biglaw firm has fairly flexible remote work options, I think i can work on biglaw in It's simply easier to get a biglaw job in NYC than anywhere else in the country This is true only if you go an elite school. During covid, usually start around 8am, finishing around 8pm. I’ve heard it varies a lot by firm, practice group and time of year but also by region. Especially with private equity all the craze now. Thanks everyone. Quirky_Material_1692. Yes, biglaw hours are often worse (though I have heard of small firm or solos that have similar grinds for far less pay), but a lot of people are willing to 1. Still long hours if you work in big law, and in the secondaries space, but not as dull and process driven as pure M&A or ECM is. 4. Hell, I know people that live in OC and work in DTLA. I was stuck staying up half the night working while I was away. The particular practice group I’m thinking of is tax. g. Chicago and San Francisco have about 8500 and 7500 respectively, so the top 5 cities have 2/3rd of all biglaw jobs. Maybe you’ll get 1 or 2 semi interesting research questions you’ll bill 20 hours to for the year. Kirkland and Sidley alone account for 200 this year. Fridays are slow usually too. Federal habeas practice is mostly a "paper" practice (reviewing extensive trial and appellate records before, and filing lengthy briefs) with very I'm a patent attorney at a biglaw firm. No fucking way. That’s an entire hobby. Starting in undergrad and through law school, have an idea of what your goals are. In either case, dedicating like $6k a month will be well within your means, and will be $72k a year towards the loans. If you want to work for a top PE fund, you'll want to be a a firm like Paul Weiss or STB. all in all, it sucks balls. Sure, it might pay a little less but you’ll actually get to work those hours. One of my friends, who is a software engineer at a mid-tier tech company, is constantly on call even during weekends and he also was recently forced to go to Check the In-House compensation surveys from Major Lindsey Africa and Robert Half, but in my experience they can be a bit high for whatever reason. When I worked in DTLA I lived in DTLA. Personally, I keep 1 year of expenses in a It scales up as you get more senior. Working as a biglaw attorney is the best job I've ever had. In my experience, There's basically New York, then the DC, Boston, Philly, Chicago tier, which are all kind of similar but not quite as formal as NY, then there's Cali/TX Aug 8, 2022 · Here are our top five tips for making it big in Biglaw: Step 1: Focus your College Career. 200 less hours each year will do that - it’s like a month less work. Two of my female colleagues are actually working part time. I really enjoy litigating, but many people do not. You can work for law firms or for the big 4, so there are ample places to choose from. I was a feminist to the core, and I firmly believed I was paving the way for future generations of women. most recruiters contact me with numbers in the mid $100s. -Type of work - The cases/deals may be bigger, more complicated, more likely to be in the WSJ, etc. I have at least one bad day a week. that you won't be able to afford if and when you leave the firm. It might give him some tools to help keep perspective and manage the make work. Biglaw v. Your husband sounds like he might benefit from some therapy if you can nudge him in that direction. Interest in subject matter makes a huge difference Big law litigation associates are prime candidates for high achiever anxiety. CON: BIGLAW position. The typical 2200 year in biglaw is not 45 hours every week. Mid-law was the worst except for pay, which was worse than big law but not as bad as small law. It will get better. If you want to work in a law firm, typically the hours, the work and culture in a mid-law, small firm is rarely significantly better than in a biglaw firm. In big4, you email the person in the national group that’s the expert and they tell you the answer. That’s a lot of life. The particular management of the legal department you land in ends up being make or break. I figured $100k is worth a month more work, so I took the Biglaw offer. The consequences of failure are enormous - the debt is immediately accelerated at the 21 days and the security is invalid. "), that's ~73 hours/week, or ~3,650 hours/year of billed time (assuming they never work a weekend and they take 2 weeks' vacation). If you want to do family law, biglaw probably isn't worth as much to you than if you want to go into mergers & acquisitions. As the title says, looking at litigation in NYC biglaw. From a recruiter's point of view, there isn't a ton of DC is definitely a step less formal than NY. 26. Biglaw emphasizes different skills than a small firm. So firms that do more of that work: Sidley, Latham, DPW, Paul Hastings, Cahill. , working on a filing that needs paper exhibits or some such thing. Close to 100% for a senior partner. My first suggestion is to consider moving practice groups. I get to put in my long hours behind a computer screen drafting and reading documents. 3% went to DC and 5. So, if this is this person's typical day (OP posits that this is "what a normal day was like for me. You will learn how the “big boys” do it. My friends that ditched biglaw early tended to have previous work experience while the K-JDs stayed for longer. I’ll work maybe one weekend a month, but that’s usually limited to 5-ish hours on a Saturday. This isn't always the case, but in broad strokes it is true. International tax is an area that allows people to work and migrate to a foreign country as the overall basics remain the same throughout. The differences in key skills and approach to work needed makes it feel like a different world. Don't splash money on a house/condo, car, etc. Silver Lake/Echo Park/etc. BigLaw is a ton of work, but is also often really flexible. Being a Biglaw attorney means you can at least live an upper middle class lifestyle and if you play your hand well, you can retire early and rich, relative to other professions. This will not make you feel better, but (1) these anxieties are very commonly experienced (many many threads here on the same issues), and (2) I can tell you from personal experience that they do not go away for many people, even when you make partner. Small law, hours were best, but I was expected, as an associate, to develop business, which, turns out, I hate. Little Tokyo also might be an option. And that type of pro-bono/Public Interest melds wonderfully with BigLaw firms. As a junior associate, you are likelier to have to be in the office because senior attorneys can just delegate office-specific tasks to you (e. Note that only 13% got jobs through OCI, meaning they had to battle . Turns out big law was far and away the best in terms of pay, quality of work, support, collegiality. Work wise, it’s a much more gunner type atmosphere: later emails, tighter deadlines, less tolerance for life getting in the way of work, and the billable hour That's 14. Selling time for money is one thing, but having a minimum amount of time billed is a way of ensuring that 4/5ths of your waking hours in a year are guaranteed to be generally quite dull. os rj bc wq on fm xn jx zb pr